Discussion:
The Fourth Age
(too old to reply)
Chucky @ Work
2013-03-07 11:00:04 UTC
Permalink
Spoiler space for The Last Book.















.














More spoiler space.











.













Not sure how much spoiler space we need.







.




That'll do.

So anyway, the Third Age ended and the Fourth Age began (heh, in the
middle of the afternoon, I liked that touch). The One Power didn't go
anywhere[1], so obviously if Chaggabaggawoggaland is Earth (as
suggested by fossilised skeletons and hood ornaments in the museum of
Tanchico), then the transition into nobody-can-use-the-One-Power[2] we
currently have on modern-day Earth is still a long way off around the
spin of the Wheel. Along with a whole mess of continental drift and
shit. Whatever.

But what was that other Power Rand used at the end of the story? He
himself seemed to have been burned out (without suffering gentled-man
syndrome, no less), but then he just wanted his pipe to be lit, so it
was?

What was *that*?

It wasn't the True Power, and it wasn't the Creator's version of the
same (which I assumed was the One Power all along anyway). So what was
it? Some sort of Perrin/Slayer-style Tel'Aran'Rhiod Power? Had Rand
strolled out of the world (possibly mid-body-swap, or sometime after
seeing Cadsuane) and into the World of Dreams in the flesh, and that
was how he was doing it?

Because "Rand wanted it to happen and so it did" seems completely
fucking irresponsible if you ask me.

Yeah, so that. Answer it.




And what's with peaches being poisonous? I originally took this to
mean the "poison" bit in the middle of the peach stone, but there are
references to this throughout the series and a couple more times in
this latest book, such as during Rand's Pattern-off with the Dark One.
He sees a woman selling peaches and he's all like "whoa, WTF those are
poisonous."

What was that about? I liked it.

- ***@w

[1] At least I assume it didn't. The Aes Sedai and everyone are still
all good and channeling and stuff, right? Nobody else says anything
about the One Power being gone, only Rand, who was painlessly burned
out during the body-swap. If everyone else was likewise painlessly
burned out, we would have noticed.

[2] Wiccans and other practitioners of the magickkckxk arts
notwithstanding.
--
13 of 12, the CMM Collective
CHOW:
http://stchucky.wordpress.com/2011/10/24/chow-a-dance-with-dragons/
Give a hoot, read my book:
http://stchucky.wordpress.com/2012/07/18/arsebook-my-rear-in-status-2011/
David DeLaney
2013-03-07 17:41:51 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chucky @ Work
Spoiler space for The Last Book.
More spoiler space.
Not sure how much spoiler space we need.
A screen or two is usually enough. It's not like respectable people are
viewing this on a webpage in 9-point font so the whole 17 screens are
visible at once...
Post by Chucky @ Work
.
That'll do.
So anyway, the Third Age ended and the Fourth Age began (heh, in the
middle of the afternoon, I liked that touch).
Look up Lawrence Watt-Evans' series The Lure of the Basilisk, The Seven Altars
of D\^usarra, The Sword of Bheleu, The Book of Silence some time then. :)
Post by Chucky @ Work
Because "Rand wanted it to happen and so it did" seems completely
fucking irresponsible if you ask me.
Well, he DID save the world, fight the Last Battle, and reimprison the Dark
One. It's probably a perk you get when you unlock that achievement.
Post by Chucky @ Work
And what's with peaches being poisonous? I originally took this to
mean the "poison" bit in the middle of the peach stone, but there are
references to this throughout the series and a couple more times in
this latest book, such as during Rand's Pattern-off with the Dark One.
He sees a woman selling peaches and he's all like "whoa, WTF those are
poisonous."
What was that about? I liked it.
Quite possibly a cross between 'their pits are poisonous / laetrile' being
distorted through the Ages and the old belief of _ours_ that TOMATOES were
deadly poison. Just because they happened to be in the nightshade family
alongside a good whack of other stuff that IS in fact the stuff of legendary
toxicity (nightshade, belladonna, etc.). Just a reminder that the ages-come-
and-go distortion of facts and stories was still in play?

Dave
--
\/David DeLaney posting from ***@vic.com "It's not the pot that grows the flower
It's not the clock that slows the hour The definition's plain for anyone to see
Love is all it takes to make a family" - R&P. VISUALIZE HAPPYNET VRbeable<BLINK>
http://www.vic.com/~dbd/ - net.legends FAQ & Magic / I WUV you in all CAPS! --K.
Chucky @ Work
2013-03-08 07:20:57 UTC
Permalink
Post by David DeLaney
Post by Chucky @ Work
Spoiler space for The Last Book.
More spoiler space.
Not sure how much spoiler space we need.
A screen or two is usually enough. It's not like respectable people are
viewing this on a webpage in 9-point font so the whole 17 screens are
visible at once...
Indeed. Not like anyone who still knows how to access this group
wouldn't know there would be spoilers so would stay away until
finishing the book ... but still, I felt they were called for. This is
serious business, a series this long in the ending.
Post by David DeLaney
Post by Chucky @ Work
That'll do.
So anyway, the Third Age ended and the Fourth Age began (heh, in the
middle of the afternoon, I liked that touch).
Look up Lawrence Watt-Evans' series The Lure of the Basilisk, The Seven Altars
of D\^usarra, The Sword of Bheleu, The Book of Silence some time then. :)
I may just.
Post by David DeLaney
Post by Chucky @ Work
Because "Rand wanted it to happen and so it did" seems completely
fucking irresponsible if you ask me.
Well, he DID save the world, fight the Last Battle, and reimprison the Dark
One. It's probably a perk you get when you unlock that achievement.
Huh. Well, yeah, but I still want an explanation!
Post by David DeLaney
Post by Chucky @ Work
And what's with peaches being poisonous? I originally took this to
mean the "poison" bit in the middle of the peach stone, but there are
references to this throughout the series and a couple more times in
this latest book, such as during Rand's Pattern-off with the Dark One.
He sees a woman selling peaches and he's all like "whoa, WTF those are
poisonous."
What was that about? I liked it.
Quite possibly a cross between 'their pits are poisonous / laetrile' being
distorted through the Ages and the old belief of _ours_ that TOMATOES were
deadly poison. Just because they happened to be in the nightshade family
alongside a good whack of other stuff that IS in fact the stuff of legendary
toxicity (nightshade, belladonna, etc.). Just a reminder that the ages-come-
and-go distortion of facts and stories was still in play?
Fair. But how long was that shit believed, before someone just went
and ate one and went, "actually, that's pretty tasty"?

And didn't the Pattern-off vision mention something about removing the
toxin with the One Power? So there was arguably something to remove?




- ***@w
--
13 of 12, the CMM Collective
CHOW:
http://stchucky.wordpress.com/2011/10/24/chow-a-dance-with-dragons/
Give a hoot, read my book:
http://stchucky.wordpress.com/2012/07/18/arsebook-my-rear-in-status-2011/
Contro
2013-03-07 20:05:26 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chucky @ Work
Spoiler space for The Last Book.
.
More spoiler space.
.
Not sure how much spoiler space we need.
.
That'll do.
So anyway, the Third Age ended and the Fourth Age began (heh, in the
middle of the afternoon, I liked that touch). The One Power didn't go
anywhere[1], so obviously if Chaggabaggawoggaland is Earth (as
suggested by fossilised skeletons and hood ornaments in the museum of
Tanchico), then the transition into nobody-can-use-the-One-Power[2] we
currently have on modern-day Earth is still a long way off around the
spin of the Wheel. Along with a whole mess of continental drift and
shit. Whatever.
But what was that other Power Rand used at the end of the story? He
himself seemed to have been burned out (without suffering gentled-man
syndrome, no less), but then he just wanted his pipe to be lit, so it
was?
What was *that*?
It wasn't the True Power, and it wasn't the Creator's version of the
same (which I assumed was the One Power all along anyway). So what was
it? Some sort of Perrin/Slayer-style Tel'Aran'Rhiod Power? Had Rand
strolled out of the world (possibly mid-body-swap, or sometime after
seeing Cadsuane) and into the World of Dreams in the flesh, and that
was how he was doing it?
Because "Rand wanted it to happen and so it did" seems completely
fucking irresponsible if you ask me.
Yeah, so that. Answer it.
I'm not sure really. Why do you think it wasn't anything to do with the
creator? He has been reborn in another body, a bit like the DO always
did with his minions, so perhaps the Creator has done it with Rand, and
given him his version of the TP.

I don't know what the One Power is, but it may not be the Creator's
version of TP because you'd imagine he wouldn't allow baddies to use it...

Besides that though...it must be odd for the Wives of Rand to experience
him in a Moridin's body...! I mean, well, let's just hope he's just as
endowed, or more so, than Rand was! Or even if he is, well, you'd
imagine some questions about them preferring Moridin's body! I think
it'll all end in divorce, or whatever they have.
Chucky @ Work
2013-03-08 07:29:21 UTC
Permalink
Post by Contro
Post by Chucky @ Work
Spoiler space for The Last Book.
.
More spoiler space.
.
Not sure how much spoiler space we need.
.
That'll do.
So anyway, the Third Age ended and the Fourth Age began (heh, in the
middle of the afternoon, I liked that touch). The One Power didn't go
anywhere[1], so obviously if Chaggabaggawoggaland is Earth (as
suggested by fossilised skeletons and hood ornaments in the museum of
Tanchico), then the transition into nobody-can-use-the-One-Power[2] we
currently have on modern-day Earth is still a long way off around the
spin of the Wheel. Along with a whole mess of continental drift and
shit. Whatever.
But what was that other Power Rand used at the end of the story? He
himself seemed to have been burned out (without suffering gentled-man
syndrome, no less), but then he just wanted his pipe to be lit, so it
was?
What was *that*?
It wasn't the True Power, and it wasn't the Creator's version of the
same (which I assumed was the One Power all along anyway). So what was
it? Some sort of Perrin/Slayer-style Tel'Aran'Rhiod Power? Had Rand
strolled out of the world (possibly mid-body-swap, or sometime after
seeing Cadsuane) and into the World of Dreams in the flesh, and that
was how he was doing it?
Because "Rand wanted it to happen and so it did" seems completely
fucking irresponsible if you ask me.
Yeah, so that. Answer it.
I'm not sure really. Why do you think it wasn't anything to do with the
creator? He has been reborn in another body, a bit like the DO always
did with his minions, so perhaps the Creator has done it with Rand, and
given him his version of the TP.
But -
Post by Contro
I don't know what the One Power is, but it may not be the Creator's
version of TP because you'd imagine he wouldn't allow baddies to use it...
Well, I assumed the True Power was the Dark One's equivalent of the
One Power. So obviously the One Power was the Creator's version. It
powers the universe, turns the Wheel. That's the Creator all over. It
doesn't play favourites. The Creator was considerably more hands-off
than the Dark One.

And even the Dark One "allowed" Rand to use the True Power. That was a
bit of a blunder.

But sure. Maybe when he merged saidar, saidin and the True Power
together at the end - or made Moridin do it - and then ended up in
Moridin's body, what he ended up with was a feeling like he had been
burned out, unable to touch any *one* of saidar, saidin or the True
Power ... and not *missing* the ability ... but able to access some
merging of all three?

I don't know how that works, since the True Power was completely
inaccessible until Lanfear created the bore in the first place, and
now the bore is gone again. But maybe there was something instilled in
Moridin's body, by the Creator as part of a reward, as suggested in
the previous post.

Or heck, it might just have been a remnant of his new Pattern-off
power that he used in the duel with the Dark One, allowing him to
affect the Pattern directly. It wasn't really saidin allowing him to
do that, he was just outside the Pattern with the Dark One and was
able to manipulate stuff. Maybe that ability stayed with him. He can
affect reality the same way someone in Tel'Aran'Rhiod can affect it by
concentrating.

Yeah, that sort of works.
Post by Contro
Besides that though...it must be odd for the Wives of Rand to experience
him in a Moridin's body...! I mean, well, let's just hope he's just as
endowed, or more so, than Rand was! Or even if he is, well, you'd
imagine some questions about them preferring Moridin's body! I think
it'll all end in divorce, or whatever they have.
Too weird, that scene where he departed, wondering which of them would
come after him, or if all three would, and which one would come first
... yeah, you stay classy there, Sanderjordan.

But anyway, Moridin was described as being much the same in build and
appearance as Rand. So yeah, whatever, meat is meat, right? Chicks
don't care about that stuff.

What?



- ***@w
--
13 of 12, the CMM Collective
CHOW:
http://stchucky.wordpress.com/2011/10/24/chow-a-dance-with-dragons/
Give a hoot, read my book:
http://stchucky.wordpress.com/2012/07/18/arsebook-my-rear-in-status-2011/
Contro
2013-03-09 16:11:45 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chucky @ Work
Post by Contro
Post by Chucky @ Work
Spoiler space for The Last Book.
.
More spoiler space.
.
Not sure how much spoiler space we need.
.
That'll do.
So anyway, the Third Age ended and the Fourth Age began (heh, in the
middle of the afternoon, I liked that touch). The One Power didn't go
anywhere[1], so obviously if Chaggabaggawoggaland is Earth (as
suggested by fossilised skeletons and hood ornaments in the museum of
Tanchico), then the transition into nobody-can-use-the-One-Power[2] we
currently have on modern-day Earth is still a long way off around the
spin of the Wheel. Along with a whole mess of continental drift and
shit. Whatever.
But what was that other Power Rand used at the end of the story? He
himself seemed to have been burned out (without suffering gentled-man
syndrome, no less), but then he just wanted his pipe to be lit, so it
was?
What was *that*?
It wasn't the True Power, and it wasn't the Creator's version of the
same (which I assumed was the One Power all along anyway). So what was
it? Some sort of Perrin/Slayer-style Tel'Aran'Rhiod Power? Had Rand
strolled out of the world (possibly mid-body-swap, or sometime after
seeing Cadsuane) and into the World of Dreams in the flesh, and that
was how he was doing it?
Because "Rand wanted it to happen and so it did" seems completely
fucking irresponsible if you ask me.
Yeah, so that. Answer it.
I'm not sure really. Why do you think it wasn't anything to do with the
creator? He has been reborn in another body, a bit like the DO always
did with his minions, so perhaps the Creator has done it with Rand, and
given him his version of the TP.
But -
Post by Contro
I don't know what the One Power is, but it may not be the Creator's
version of TP because you'd imagine he wouldn't allow baddies to use it...
Well, I assumed the True Power was the Dark One's equivalent of the
One Power. So obviously the One Power was the Creator's version. It
powers the universe, turns the Wheel. That's the Creator all over. It
doesn't play favourites. The Creator was considerably more hands-off
than the Dark One.
And even the Dark One "allowed" Rand to use the True Power. That was a
bit of a blunder.
But sure. Maybe when he merged saidar, saidin and the True Power
together at the end - or made Moridin do it - and then ended up in
Moridin's body, what he ended up with was a feeling like he had been
burned out, unable to touch any *one* of saidar, saidin or the True
Power ... and not *missing* the ability ... but able to access some
merging of all three?
I don't know how that works, since the True Power was completely
inaccessible until Lanfear created the bore in the first place, and
now the bore is gone again. But maybe there was something instilled in
Moridin's body, by the Creator as part of a reward, as suggested in
the previous post.
Or heck, it might just have been a remnant of his new Pattern-off
power that he used in the duel with the Dark One, allowing him to
affect the Pattern directly. It wasn't really saidin allowing him to
do that, he was just outside the Pattern with the Dark One and was
able to manipulate stuff. Maybe that ability stayed with him. He can
affect reality the same way someone in Tel'Aran'Rhiod can affect it by
concentrating.
Yeah, that sort of works.
LOL yes, true....other than it being some sort of Creator True Power
equivalent, which, as you say, may not be likely, then this could be it.

Either that, or Moridin was practising to be a Gleeman, and Rand now has
access to all the tricks!
Post by Chucky @ Work
Post by Contro
Besides that though...it must be odd for the Wives of Rand to experience
him in a Moridin's body...! I mean, well, let's just hope he's just as
endowed, or more so, than Rand was! Or even if he is, well, you'd
imagine some questions about them preferring Moridin's body! I think
it'll all end in divorce, or whatever they have.
Too weird, that scene where he departed, wondering which of them would
come after him, or if all three would, and which one would come first
... yeah, you stay classy there, Sanderjordan.
But anyway, Moridin was described as being much the same in build and
appearance as Rand. So yeah, whatever, meat is meat, right? Chicks
don't care about that stuff.
What?
LOL you can just imagine their disappointment...and them pointing saying
"we won the Last Battle for THAT?!"
--
Contro.
Chucky @ Work
2013-03-11 06:00:56 UTC
Permalink
Post by Contro
Post by Chucky @ Work
Post by Contro
Post by Chucky @ Work
Spoiler space for The Last Book.
.
More spoiler space.
.
Not sure how much spoiler space we need.
.
I don't know what the One Power is, but it may not be the Creator's
version of TP because you'd imagine he wouldn't allow baddies to use it...
Well, I assumed the True Power was the Dark One's equivalent of the
One Power. So obviously the One Power was the Creator's version. It
powers the universe, turns the Wheel. That's the Creator all over. It
doesn't play favourites. The Creator was considerably more hands-off
than the Dark One.
And even the Dark One "allowed" Rand to use the True Power. That was a
bit of a blunder.
But sure. Maybe when he merged saidar, saidin and the True Power
together at the end - or made Moridin do it - and then ended up in
Moridin's body, what he ended up with was a feeling like he had been
burned out, unable to touch any *one* of saidar, saidin or the True
Power ... and not *missing* the ability ... but able to access some
merging of all three?
I don't know how that works, since the True Power was completely
inaccessible until Lanfear created the bore in the first place, and
now the bore is gone again. But maybe there was something instilled in
Moridin's body, by the Creator as part of a reward, as suggested in
the previous post.
Or heck, it might just have been a remnant of his new Pattern-off
power that he used in the duel with the Dark One, allowing him to
affect the Pattern directly. It wasn't really saidin allowing him to
do that, he was just outside the Pattern with the Dark One and was
able to manipulate stuff. Maybe that ability stayed with him. He can
affect reality the same way someone in Tel'Aran'Rhiod can affect it by
concentrating.
Yeah, that sort of works.
LOL yes, true....other than it being some sort of Creator True Power
equivalent, which, as you say, may not be likely, then this could be it.
If there was a True Power for the Creator and for the Dark One, and
the One Power is just a sort of universal omni-power, I'd want more
sign of it in the rest of the book rather than the final paragraph of
the entire series.

And I'd have to wonder why Mierin Sedai didn't try to tap into that
instead of the Dark One's True Power.

And I'd have to wonder why Rand didn't use it in his multi-Power
weaving trick.
Post by Contro
Either that, or Moridin was practising to be a Gleeman, and Rand now has
access to all the tricks!
Dying all those times taught Moridin to have a contingency plan.
Post by Contro
Post by Chucky @ Work
Post by Contro
Besides that though...it must be odd for the Wives of Rand to experience
him in a Moridin's body...! I mean, well, let's just hope he's just as
endowed, or more so, than Rand was! Or even if he is, well, you'd
imagine some questions about them preferring Moridin's body! I think
it'll all end in divorce, or whatever they have.
Too weird, that scene where he departed, wondering which of them would
come after him, or if all three would, and which one would come first
... yeah, you stay classy there, Sanderjordan.
But anyway, Moridin was described as being much the same in build and
appearance as Rand. So yeah, whatever, meat is meat, right? Chicks
don't care about that stuff.
What?
LOL you can just imagine their disappointment...and them pointing saying
"we won the Last Battle for THAT?!"
And Rand finally understanding why Ishamael always hated Lews Therin
so much.




- ***@w
--
13 of 12, the CMM Collective
CHOW:
http://stchucky.wordpress.com/2011/10/24/chow-a-dance-with-dragons/
Give a hoot, read my book:
http://stchucky.wordpress.com/2012/07/18/arsebook-my-rear-in-status-2011/
Contro
2013-03-16 11:53:26 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chucky @ Work
Post by Contro
Post by Chucky @ Work
Post by Contro
Post by Chucky @ Work
Spoiler space for The Last Book.
.
More spoiler space.
.
Not sure how much spoiler space we need.
.
I don't know what the One Power is, but it may not be the Creator's
version of TP because you'd imagine he wouldn't allow baddies to use it...
Well, I assumed the True Power was the Dark One's equivalent of the
One Power. So obviously the One Power was the Creator's version. It
powers the universe, turns the Wheel. That's the Creator all over. It
doesn't play favourites. The Creator was considerably more hands-off
than the Dark One.
And even the Dark One "allowed" Rand to use the True Power. That was a
bit of a blunder.
But sure. Maybe when he merged saidar, saidin and the True Power
together at the end - or made Moridin do it - and then ended up in
Moridin's body, what he ended up with was a feeling like he had been
burned out, unable to touch any *one* of saidar, saidin or the True
Power ... and not *missing* the ability ... but able to access some
merging of all three?
I don't know how that works, since the True Power was completely
inaccessible until Lanfear created the bore in the first place, and
now the bore is gone again. But maybe there was something instilled in
Moridin's body, by the Creator as part of a reward, as suggested in
the previous post.
Or heck, it might just have been a remnant of his new Pattern-off
power that he used in the duel with the Dark One, allowing him to
affect the Pattern directly. It wasn't really saidin allowing him to
do that, he was just outside the Pattern with the Dark One and was
able to manipulate stuff. Maybe that ability stayed with him. He can
affect reality the same way someone in Tel'Aran'Rhiod can affect it by
concentrating.
Yeah, that sort of works.
LOL yes, true....other than it being some sort of Creator True Power
equivalent, which, as you say, may not be likely, then this could be it.
If there was a True Power for the Creator and for the Dark One, and
the One Power is just a sort of universal omni-power, I'd want more
sign of it in the rest of the book rather than the final paragraph of
the entire series.
LOL yes, this is a good point...but it could be implied...if there's a
power that is direct from the Dark One, you could imagine they're be one
direct from the Creator...assuming the TP isn't the same for them both,
and then can both grant it.

I can't remember how we know Rand wasn't using the TP (given by the
Creator)? Was that discounted?
Post by Chucky @ Work
And I'd have to wonder why Mierin Sedai didn't try to tap into that
instead of the Dark One's True Power.
Well perhaps they didn't know it existed - they didn't know the Dark
One/True Power existed until they found the Bore.
Post by Chucky @ Work
And I'd have to wonder why Rand didn't use it in his multi-Power
weaving trick.
I think he'd only get this power now he's saved the world perhaps. A bit
late, I grant you, but he's got this power from somewhere or someone a
bit late in the day!
Post by Chucky @ Work
Post by Contro
Either that, or Moridin was practising to be a Gleeman, and Rand now has
access to all the tricks!
Dying all those times taught Moridin to have a contingency plan.
He was pretty useless.
Post by Chucky @ Work
Post by Contro
Post by Chucky @ Work
Post by Contro
Besides that though...it must be odd for the Wives of Rand to experience
him in a Moridin's body...! I mean, well, let's just hope he's just as
endowed, or more so, than Rand was! Or even if he is, well, you'd
imagine some questions about them preferring Moridin's body! I think
it'll all end in divorce, or whatever they have.
Too weird, that scene where he departed, wondering which of them would
come after him, or if all three would, and which one would come first
... yeah, you stay classy there, Sanderjordan.
But anyway, Moridin was described as being much the same in build and
appearance as Rand. So yeah, whatever, meat is meat, right? Chicks
don't care about that stuff.
What?
LOL you can just imagine their disappointment...and them pointing saying
"we won the Last Battle for THAT?!"
And Rand finally understanding why Ishamael always hated Lews Therin
so much.
LOL I think we have the true reasons for the series and the war against
the shadow!
--
Contro.
Chucky @ Work
2013-03-18 07:22:12 UTC
Permalink
Post by Contro
Post by Chucky @ Work
Post by Contro
Post by Chucky @ Work
Post by Contro
Post by Chucky @ Work
Spoiler space for The Last Book.
.
More spoiler space.
.
Not sure how much spoiler space we need.
.
I don't know what the One Power is, but it may not be the Creator's
version of TP because you'd imagine he wouldn't allow baddies to use it...
Well, I assumed the True Power was the Dark One's equivalent of the
One Power. So obviously the One Power was the Creator's version. It
powers the universe, turns the Wheel. That's the Creator all over. It
doesn't play favourites. The Creator was considerably more hands-off
than the Dark One.
And even the Dark One "allowed" Rand to use the True Power. That was a
bit of a blunder.
But sure. Maybe when he merged saidar, saidin and the True Power
together at the end - or made Moridin do it - and then ended up in
Moridin's body, what he ended up with was a feeling like he had been
burned out, unable to touch any *one* of saidar, saidin or the True
Power ... and not *missing* the ability ... but able to access some
merging of all three?
I don't know how that works, since the True Power was completely
inaccessible until Lanfear created the bore in the first place, and
now the bore is gone again. But maybe there was something instilled in
Moridin's body, by the Creator as part of a reward, as suggested in
the previous post.
Or heck, it might just have been a remnant of his new Pattern-off
power that he used in the duel with the Dark One, allowing him to
affect the Pattern directly. It wasn't really saidin allowing him to
do that, he was just outside the Pattern with the Dark One and was
able to manipulate stuff. Maybe that ability stayed with him. He can
affect reality the same way someone in Tel'Aran'Rhiod can affect it by
concentrating.
Yeah, that sort of works.
LOL yes, true....other than it being some sort of Creator True Power
equivalent, which, as you say, may not be likely, then this could be it.
If there was a True Power for the Creator and for the Dark One, and
the One Power is just a sort of universal omni-power, I'd want more
sign of it in the rest of the book rather than the final paragraph of
the entire series.
LOL yes, this is a good point...but it could be implied...if there's a
power that is direct from the Dark One, you could imagine they're be one
direct from the Creator...
Gaaaaaaaaaaaaaah no, the ONE Power was implied to be the Creator's
power, at least that was my understanding. If not, then they left it
way too late to introduce the concept.
Post by Contro
assuming the TP isn't the same for them both,
and then can both grant it.
The True Power was ... what? You mean it was a power that the Dark One
or the Creator could consciously grant, which only became accessible
when Lanfear created the bore and opened the Dark One's prison? I'm
not seeing it.
Post by Contro
I can't remember how we know Rand wasn't using the TP (given by the
Creator)? Was that discounted?
When? Rand used the True Power, as in the Dark One's power, once or
twice in the last couple of books, specifically when he used it to
free himself from the a'dam, since the One Power wouldn't work for him
there. But as you say later, that wasn't a thing he was only granted
after savingthe world. That was something that had happened before.

There was no specific mention of it coming directly from the Dark One,
so yeah, it might have been the Creator who granted it. It might have
been the same power as the one he used in the final scene (but didn't
seem to be using in his battle with Moridin and the Dark One, unless
it was the Pattern-bending power I was referring to previously).

But I'm just not seeing it. Rand found out that he was unable to
channel the One Power in that final scene, and then he checked, and
was relived to find that the True Power was *also* gone - as would
make sense, since the Dark One's prison was once again properly
sealed.
Post by Contro
Post by Chucky @ Work
And I'd have to wonder why Mierin Sedai didn't try to tap into that
instead of the Dark One's True Power.
Well perhaps they didn't know it existed - they didn't know the Dark
One/True Power existed until they found the Bore.
They knew *something* existed, because that power was what Mierin
Sedai was trying to tap into.
Post by Contro
Post by Chucky @ Work
And I'd have to wonder why Rand didn't use it in his multi-Power
weaving trick.
I think he'd only get this power now he's saved the world perhaps. A bit
late, I grant you, but he's got this power from somewhere or someone a
bit late in the day!
Alright, in that case, he never used it before.
Post by Contro
Post by Chucky @ Work
Post by Contro
LOL you can just imagine their disappointment...and them pointing saying
"we won the Last Battle for THAT?!"
And Rand finally understanding why Ishamael always hated Lews Therin
so much.
LOL I think we have the true reasons for the series and the war against
the shadow!
And that was why the Dark One could never get into the Pattern's
pants. He just didn't have the swing for it.



- ***@w
--
13 of 12, the CMM Collective
CHOW:
http://stchucky.wordpress.com/2011/10/24/chow-a-dance-with-dragons/
Give a hoot, read my book:
http://stchucky.wordpress.com/2012/07/18/arsebook-my-rear-in-status-2011/
TB
2013-03-08 21:52:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chucky @ Work
Spoiler space for The Last Book.
.
More spoiler space.
.
Not sure how much spoiler space we need.
.
That'll do.
So anyway, the Third Age ended and the Fourth Age began (heh, in the
middle of the afternoon, I liked that touch). The One Power didn't go
anywhere[1], so obviously if Chaggabaggawoggaland is Earth (as
suggested by fossilised skeletons and hood ornaments in the museum of
Tanchico), then the transition into nobody-can-use-the-One-Power[2] we
currently have on modern-day Earth is still a long way off around the
spin of the Wheel. Along with a whole mess of continental drift and
shit. Whatever.
But what was that other Power Rand used at the end of the story? He
himself seemed to have been burned out (without suffering gentled-man
syndrome, no less), but then he just wanted his pipe to be lit, so it
was?
What was *that*?
It wasn't the True Power, and it wasn't the Creator's version of the
same (which I assumed was the One Power all along anyway). So what was
it? Some sort of Perrin/Slayer-style Tel'Aran'Rhiod Power? Had Rand
strolled out of the world (possibly mid-body-swap, or sometime after
seeing Cadsuane) and into the World of Dreams in the flesh, and that
was how he was doing it?
Because "Rand wanted it to happen and so it did" seems completely
fucking irresponsible if you ask me.
Yeah, so that. Answer it.
I'm not sure really.  Why do you think it wasn't anything to do with the
creator?  He has been reborn in another body, a bit like the DO always
did with his minions, so perhaps the Creator has done it with Rand, and
given him his version of the TP.
I don't know what the One Power is, but it may not be the Creator's
version of TP because you'd imagine he wouldn't allow baddies to use it...
Besides that though...it must be odd for the Wives of Rand to experience
him in a Moridin's body...!  I mean, well, let's just hope he's just as
endowed, or more so, than Rand was!  Or even if he is, well, you'd
imagine some questions about them preferring Moridin's body!  I think
it'll all end in divorce, or whatever they have.
Can Seanchan nobles divorce simply by saying so three times?
Chucky @ Work
2013-03-11 06:01:21 UTC
Permalink
Post by TB
I'm not sure really.  Why do you think it wasn't anything to do with the
creator?  He has been reborn in another body, a bit like the DO always
did with his minions, so perhaps the Creator has done it with Rand, and
given him his version of the TP.
I don't know what the One Power is, but it may not be the Creator's
version of TP because you'd imagine he wouldn't allow baddies to use it...
Besides that though...it must be odd for the Wives of Rand to experience
him in a Moridin's body...!  I mean, well, let's just hope he's just as
endowed, or more so, than Rand was!  Or even if he is, well, you'd
imagine some questions about them preferring Moridin's body!  I think
it'll all end in divorce, or whatever they have.
Can Seanchan nobles divorce simply by saying so three times?
It has precedent in the real world.



- ***@w
--
13 of 12, the CMM Collective
CHOW:
http://stchucky.wordpress.com/2011/10/24/chow-a-dance-with-dragons/
Give a hoot, read my book:
http://stchucky.wordpress.com/2012/07/18/arsebook-my-rear-in-status-2011/
Sir F.A. Rien
2013-03-11 15:45:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chucky @ Work
Post by TB
Can Seanchan nobles divorce simply by saying so three times?
It has precedent in the real world.
Too bad we can't stop Timmette from crossposting by saying so three
times!
Chucky @ Work
2013-03-12 08:16:19 UTC
Permalink
Post by Sir F.A. Rien
Post by Chucky @ Work
Post by TB
Can Seanchan nobles divorce simply by saying so three times?
It has precedent in the real world.
Too bad we can't stop Timmette from crossposting by saying so three
times!
Why's that? Crossposting isn't that bad, and although I have more or
less given up on getting any sort of response from him when I answer
his questions, at least he is asking relevant questions and they can
be used to jump-start discussions between the rest of us, right?


- ***@w
--
13 of 12, the CMM Collective
CHOW:
http://stchucky.wordpress.com/2011/10/24/chow-a-dance-with-dragons/
Give a hoot, read my book:
http://stchucky.wordpress.com/2012/07/18/arsebook-my-rear-in-status-2011/
Dan Goodman
2013-03-11 23:01:57 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chucky @ Work
Post by TB
Can Seanchan nobles divorce simply by saying so three times?
It has precedent in the real world.
Well, in our world....
--
Dan Goodman
Chucky @ Work
2013-03-12 08:00:04 UTC
Permalink
Post by Dan Goodman
Post by Chucky @ Work
Post by TB
Can Seanchan nobles divorce simply by saying so three times?
It has precedent in the real world.
Well, in our world....
...

Yes...?




- ***@w
--
13 of 12, the CMM Collective
CHOW:
http://stchucky.wordpress.com/2011/10/24/chow-a-dance-with-dragons/
Give a hoot, read my book:
http://stchucky.wordpress.com/2012/07/18/arsebook-my-rear-in-status-2011/
Dan Goodman
2013-03-12 19:54:59 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chucky @ Work
Post by Dan Goodman
Post by Chucky @ Work
Post by TB
Can Seanchan nobles divorce simply by saying so three times?
It has precedent in the real world.
Well, in our world....
...
Yes...?
Are you sure the two are the same?
--
Dan Goodman
TB
2013-03-12 20:31:41 UTC
Permalink
Post by Dan Goodman
Post by Chucky @ Work
Post by Dan Goodman
Post by Chucky @ Work
Post by TB
Can Seanchan nobles divorce simply by saying so three times?
It has precedent in the real world.
Well, in our world....
...
Yes...?
Are you sure the two are the same?
We may be the First Age, following by the Second Age, the AoL, and
then the Third Age, in which the WoT series occurs.
Chucky @ Work
2013-03-13 08:57:19 UTC
Permalink
Post by Dan Goodman
Post by Chucky @ Work
Post by Dan Goodman
Post by Chucky @ Work
Post by TB
Can Seanchan nobles divorce simply by saying so three times?
It has precedent in the real world.
Well, in our world....
...
Yes...?
Are you sure the two are the same?
In that I was using "the real world" as convenient shorthand for the
world we live in, as opposed to the world of the Wheel of Time, with
due consideration for the fact that the author seemed to be hinting
that the two were in fact variations of the same world at different
points in the cycle of spacetime

...

Yes...?




- ***@w
--
13 of 12, the CMM Collective
CHOW:
http://stchucky.wordpress.com/2011/10/24/chow-a-dance-with-dragons/
Give a hoot, read my book:
http://stchucky.wordpress.com/2012/07/18/arsebook-my-rear-in-status-2011/
Ilya the Recusant
2013-04-13 15:31:24 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chucky @ Work
Post by Dan Goodman
Post by Chucky @ Work
Post by Dan Goodman
Post by Chucky @ Work
Post by TB
Can Seanchan nobles divorce simply by saying so three times?
It has precedent in the real world.
Well, in our world....
...
Yes...?
Are you sure the two are the same?
In that I was using "the real world" as convenient shorthand for the
world we live in, as opposed to the world of the Wheel of Time, with
due consideration for the fact that the author seemed to be hinting
that the two were in fact variations of the same world at different
points in the cycle of spacetime
...
Yes...?
I'll go with: works for me!

Ilya

Ilya the Recusant
-----------------
"Asshole" has a special place in my childhood, the point at which I
first learned that typical Americans were assholes.
- C&J
Ilya the Recusant
-----------------
"Asshole" has a special place in my childhood, the point at which I
first learned that typical Americans were assholes.
- C&J

Sir F.A. Rien
2013-03-13 15:24:10 UTC
Permalink
Post by Dan Goodman
Post by Chucky @ Work
Post by Dan Goodman
Post by Chucky @ Work
Post by TB
Can Seanchan nobles divorce simply by saying so three times?
It has precedent in the real world.
Well, in our world....
Yes...?
Are you sure the two are the same?
Only from worm to hole ...
Sir F.A. Rien
2013-03-12 14:45:58 UTC
Permalink
Post by Dan Goodman
Post by Chucky @ Work
Post by TB
Can Seanchan nobles divorce simply by saying so three times?
It has precedent in the real world.
Well, in our world....
It has precident!
Ain't no pope, no cat, no petal!
Aaron
2013-03-29 13:56:45 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chucky @ Work
Spoiler space for The Last Book.
.
More spoiler space.
.
Not sure how much spoiler space we need.
.
That'll do.
So anyway, the Third Age ended and the Fourth Age began (heh, in the
middle of the afternoon, I liked that touch). The One Power didn't go
anywhere[1], so obviously if Chaggabaggawoggaland is Earth (as
suggested by fossilised skeletons and hood ornaments in the museum of
Tanchico), then the transition into nobody-can-use-the-One-Power[2] we
currently have on modern-day Earth is still a long way off around the
spin of the Wheel. Along with a whole mess of continental drift and
shit. Whatever.
But what was that other Power Rand used at the end of the story? He
himself seemed to have been burned out (without suffering gentled-man
syndrome, no less), but then he just wanted his pipe to be lit, so it
was?
What was *that*?
It wasn't the True Power, and it wasn't the Creator's version of the
same (which I assumed was the One Power all along anyway). So what was
it? Some sort of Perrin/Slayer-style Tel'Aran'Rhiod Power? Had Rand
strolled out of the world (possibly mid-body-swap, or sometime after
seeing Cadsuane) and into the World of Dreams in the flesh, and that
was how he was doing it?
Because "Rand wanted it to happen and so it did" seems completely
fucking irresponsible if you ask me.
Yeah, so that. Answer it.
A wizard did it.

Someone really clever told me that was totally ok to do, in a book. So.

-Aaron
Chucky @ Work
2013-04-02 06:23:01 UTC
Permalink
Post by Aaron
Post by Chucky @ Work
Spoiler space for The Last Book.
.
More spoiler space.
.
Not sure how much spoiler space we need.
.
That'll do.
What was *that*?
It wasn't the True Power, and it wasn't the Creator's version of the
same (which I assumed was the One Power all along anyway). So what was
it? Some sort of Perrin/Slayer-style Tel'Aran'Rhiod Power? Had Rand
strolled out of the world (possibly mid-body-swap, or sometime after
seeing Cadsuane) and into the World of Dreams in the flesh, and that
was how he was doing it?
Because "Rand wanted it to happen and so it did" seems completely
fucking irresponsible if you ask me.
Yeah, so that. Answer it.
A wizard did it.
Someone really clever told me that was totally ok to do, in a book. So.
That's true. It helps to have a bit of precedent, though.

I like the possibility that the Creator had granted him access to some
sort of previously-unseen Truer Power. I also like the idea that he
was using the Pattern-changing ability he learned in his duel with the
Dark One. At least that was introduced slightly previously in the
story and had some sort of explanation.



***@w
--
13 of 12, the CMM Collective
CHOW:
http://stchucky.wordpress.com/2011/10/24/chow-a-dance-with-dragons/
Give a hoot, read my book:
http://stchucky.wordpress.com/2012/07/18/arsebook-my-rear-in-status-2011/
Aaron
2013-04-03 12:46:09 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chucky @ Work
Post by Aaron
Post by Chucky @ Work
Spoiler space for The Last Book.
.
More spoiler space.
.
Not sure how much spoiler space we need.
.
That'll do.
What was *that*?
It wasn't the True Power, and it wasn't the Creator's version of the
same (which I assumed was the One Power all along anyway). So what was
it? Some sort of Perrin/Slayer-style Tel'Aran'Rhiod Power? Had Rand
strolled out of the world (possibly mid-body-swap, or sometime after
seeing Cadsuane) and into the World of Dreams in the flesh, and that
was how he was doing it?
Because "Rand wanted it to happen and so it did" seems completely
fucking irresponsible if you ask me.
Yeah, so that. Answer it.
A wizard did it.
Someone really clever told me that was totally ok to do, in a book. So.
That's true. It helps to have a bit of precedent, though.
A...precedent...for wizards and magic...in the WOT...?

Ok. Yeah that would certainly be nice....
Post by Chucky @ Work
I like the possibility that the Creator had granted him access to some
sort of previously-unseen Truer Power. I also like the idea that he
was using the Pattern-changing ability he learned in his duel with the
Dark One. At least that was introduced slightly previously in the
story and had some sort of explanation.
But I think that only applies in Shayol Ghul or whatever.

-Aaron
Chucky @ Work
2013-04-04 08:28:12 UTC
Permalink
Post by Aaron
Post by Chucky @ Work
Post by Chucky @ Work
Spoiler space for The Last Book.
.
More spoiler space.
.
Not sure how much spoiler space we need.
.
That'll do.
I like the possibility that the Creator had granted him access to some
sort of previously-unseen Truer Power. I also like the idea that he
was using the Pattern-changing ability he learned in his duel with the
Dark One. At least that was introduced slightly previously in the
story and had some sort of explanation.
But I think that only applies in Shayol Ghul or whatever.
Maybe. Unless it doesn't. Maybe it only applies to someone who has
been outside the Pattern and learned how to do it, the way Rand did?


***@w
--
13 of 12, the CMM Collective
CHOW:
http://stchucky.wordpress.com/2011/10/24/chow-a-dance-with-dragons/
Give a hoot, read my book:
http://stchucky.wordpress.com/2012/07/18/arsebook-my-rear-in-status-2011/
Aaron
2013-04-09 11:28:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chucky @ Work
Post by Aaron
Post by Chucky @ Work
Post by Chucky @ Work
Spoiler space for The Last Book.
.
More spoiler space.
.
Not sure how much spoiler space we need.
.
That'll do.
I like the possibility that the Creator had granted him access to some
sort of previously-unseen Truer Power. I also like the idea that he
was using the Pattern-changing ability he learned in his duel with the
Dark One. At least that was introduced slightly previously in the
story and had some sort of explanation.
But I think that only applies in Shayol Ghul or whatever.
Maybe. Unless it doesn't. Maybe it only applies to someone who has
been outside the Pattern and learned how to do it, the way Rand did?
Quite possi-blye.

-Aaron
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